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The Yeshiva world doesn’t appreciate it enough.
Like other missionaries, they work to promote the twisted beliefs of their sect, including promoting their long gone Moshiach sheker as the leader of the Jews, and themselves as the real Jews, as well as lining their own pockets, as we saw at Poway, and elsewhere.
lakewhut is missing the point …
yeshiva world does appreciate chabad’s moser nefesh …
but does not appreciate chabad using that mesirut nefesh as leverage to convert unsuspecting innocents
into accepting corrupted false messianism
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.If you are actually sincere, then it is time that you realize that anything you post here about Chabad is Avak Lashon Hara.
If you are trying to instigate, you are doing a great job.
To Lakewhut
I disagree with your premise. I think that all those who criticize Chabad on YWN agree that the Shlichim serve a valuable function and we encourage them in their efforts.
Baalei Teshuvah are Real Moser Nefesh and the Yeshiva world does not appreciate them enough.
@square_root
doing tshiva is not mesiras nefesh. they mean different things.
also, why the condecending attitde towards baalei tshiva? they don’t neeed to be appreciated more than any other kosher yid. we all must do tshiva.IDF soldiers are real moser nefesh. The yeshiva world doesn’t appreciate them enough.
Several years ago, Chabad missionaries sent out robo-calls announcing an event at a Lakewood park where Jews could “give kavod to the Moshiach”.
These misleading claims about Chabad’s false “Moshiach” are huge scams that greatly dishonor the Torah and dishonor the Jewish prophets who described the Moshiach as a living Jewish king in Jerusalem who rules over the world.
The deceased Chabad rebbe was never in Israel and he was never a Jewish king.
In the not so distant future, I believe Chabad may officially separate itself from Orthodox Judaism.
Chabad will then be recognized as a non-Torah offshoot religion of Judaism, similar to Xtianity and complete with a deceased false messiah who was resurrected and is expected to reappear at any moment.
To other posters:
You don’t have to agree with all Chabad beliefs about the Rebbe. I certainly don’t. But there’s a complacency and an arrogance to say you have a problem with them teaching those beliefs to others. The reason Chabad is teaching those beliefs to others (to the limited extent that they are- I’ve encountered a lot of Lubavitchers and originally became frum through them, and I didn’t find that turning people into meshichists is the focus at all) is because they’re THERE. They’re working hard in the small, far-flung communities where mainstream kiruv organizations don’t go. If you really have a problem with it, instead of criticizing from a keyboard, put your time and effort into expanding litvish kiruv efforts.Off topic but I agree with the poster who said baalei teshuva (and geirim) are moser nefesh and unappreciated. Many people pay lip service to admiring them but really, deep down, they look down on them.
To E120
I fully agree with your post. The criticisms that I’ve leveled at Chabad speak to its distortions of Judaism, but that really isn’t a factor when it comes to dealing with the unaffiliated. I’ve never seen a Lubavicher actively try to make someone a believer in the Rebbe as a deity.
lol
lakewhut is living in a fantasy world where the problems with chabad are that they do not wear white shirts and that they have a ‘propaganda machine’ …
he seems totally disconnected
its not the shirts …
it’s not the propaganda machine ….
it’s the rubbish this machine is spreading ….
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.there is no ‘complacency and arrogance’ in calling out blatant misrepresentations of the ideas and principals of
the judaism as it was received and maintained for the last 3000 years
not at all …
habad can disseminate their distortions as much as they want
it is a free world
so can we – and should we – call out those very same distortions as much as we want
it is a free world
and let the best and most convincing ideas and proofs win
we are not scared of any contest on its own merits
equally they should not be scared of a fact and logic based contest either
and if they – or anyone else – are attempting to shut down a fact and logic based debate on any grounds …
then that attempt in itself should serve as a damning and final indictment of their position ….
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there is no need whatsoever to ‘be out there’ ….
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.agree with you re the mesirut nefesh of baalei tshuva and geirim
its immense – in my opinion at least
they leave behind their family , many things they grew up with – for emet and conviction
I admire them for real
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> why the condecending attitde towards baalei tshiva? they don’t neeed to be appreciated more than any other kosher yid. we all must do tshiva.
well, some “must” – while others demonstratively “did”. There is a difference.
Apropos quiz: 5 frogs are sitting on a log. One decided to jump off. How many frogs are now sitting on the log?
RJ > announcing an event at a Lakewood park where Jews could “give kavod to the Moshiach”.
I once saw an appropriate response – a chabad piano player started “moschiach” song, so the Lakewood rov got up, picked up (a much smaller) chabad rabbi and danced with him until the latter fell off … – to show that Moschiach does not belong to just one group.
E120> . They’re working hard in the small, far-flung communities where mainstream kiruv organizations don’t go.
Not just that. “Kiruv” organizations started well later after Chabad in any-size towns. And also “modern” YU-affiliated rabbis were going into less-observant communities/
> If you really have a problem with it, instead of criticizing from a keyboard, put your time and effort into expanding litvish kiruv efforts.
Many are not capable. My kids report that many well-meaning volunteers from isolationist communities have hard time relating to aspiring baalei teshuva when given a chance to interact with them. Maybe, as a first step, such people could help support exisintg chabad/YU/kiruv communities. For example, visit those far-away chabad houses, have thier children interact with shluchim children, invite those children for “in town” va cations.
To E120
You made a very generic statement about Chabad beliefs. Would you care to share what you think are those beliefs? Since I Daven in a Chabad shul. I see first hand how Chabad interacts with its minions. I’ll share this story. A few years ago, the first day of Sukkos came out on a Sunday night. It rained all day Sunday and it looked like eating on a Sukkah would be a washout for the first night. As it turned out the rain let up enough so that we could eat in the Sukkah, although it was drizzling. A guy sitting next to me said, “Thank you Hashem for stopping the rain so we can have the Mitzvah of eating in the Sukkah. One of the Chabd Rabbis overheard him and said, “That wasn’t Hashem, it was the Rebbe who made the rain stop.” Immediately another fellow in the Sukkah said, “Everything we have in our lives comes from the Rebbe. “And his friend added, “We live in the shadow of the Rebbe.” Would you care to comment?
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